Having problem with theodicy (the problem of evil)?

Having problem with theodicy (the problem of evil)? Topic: Having problem with theodicy (the problem of evil)?
July 18, 2019 / By Aldwen
Question: I don't see it as necessarily secular and I can't figure out how to define evil because it seems so subjective. Any and all input will be greatly appreciated (as long as it is pertinent) thanks. my issue is defining evil- but I can't figure out how evil HAS to be secular, couldn't it be causal?
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Best Answers: Having problem with theodicy (the problem of evil)?

Tallulah Tallulah | 2 days ago
St. Augustine defines evil as the ability to be corrupted. Therefore, evil is all that is impermanent and finite (things that God is not). However, I don't see why you need a philosophical definition of evil to understand the problem of evil. The peculiarity is not semantical, but rather the /existence/ of corruption when the universe is run by a infinite, omnipotent, omnibenevolent and omniscient God. Also: how can anything pertaining to Christianity and the problems it raises be secular? And: evil is NOT AT ALL subjective to a Christian mind. If you are trying to solve the problem of evil, then you must hold the nature of God to be your premise. Since God is ultimate and objective good, it follows that evil is also objective.
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Tallulah Originally Answered: A problem for christians: the problem of evil?
Keep the question open, I will write a response. I will have to come back later though because I have a Bible study. EDIT: Since you really asked several questions I will only deal with the first issue that you cite. “The problem of evil has been called one of the most powerful objections to the existence of God. Its strength lies in the simple contradiction that an all powerful and caring God seemingly allows horrible things to happen to innocent people.” To get at this, let’s put this in a kind of logical form: An omnipotent God could stop evil. A completely compassionate God would stop evil. Evil is not stopped. Therefore, there is no such God. Note that this argument only seems to rule out the possibility of an omnipotent and completely compassionate God, but does not rule out the possibility of a finite god, just FYI. I, as a Christian, respond that the first two propositions are not completely accurate. The first statement is true as far as it goes, but we must realize that for God to stop evil, He would have to take away free agency. Since evil is not a thing, but a corruption of a thing, the only way to stop evil is to take away mankind’s ability to choose to do evil. But a non-moral universe is not better than a moral universe; they cannot even be compared. Furthermore, when considering natural evil, which is a result of Adam’s sin (Creation is cursed because of Adam’s sin - Genesis 3), the only way to have avoided that would be to have created a non-moral universe, or for Adam not to have sinned. The second statement is likewise problematic when used to support the conclusion. This is because God has promised to one day overcome evil. So just because it is not done yet, doesn’t mean that it will never be done, it means that it is not yet done. Now let’s deal with the most difficult part of the original statement as you quoted. Namely: “…allows horrible things to happen to innocent people.” There are two problems here as well. First, the simple, humbling fact is that the term innocent as used in this sentence is the kind of innocent as judged by mankind, not as judged by God. Mankind sees a child killed by a tornado as an innocent victim, but God sees all mankind as guilty of sin, for we are born into judgment and sin (Rom. 5:12 & 6:23). Now this doesn’t mean that the death of that child was a direct judgment on that child, but it does mean that that child was not innocent in God’s eyes. Therefore, it is only through pride that mankind can say to God who created him, “My judgment is superior to yours.” Second, physical death is not the end of things for people. Only a non-believer thinks that it is evil to die. A believer thinks that it is *because* of evil that we die physically. Now a totally different question is where does a small child who dies end up, heaven or Hell? That is a whole other debate which I won’t go into here, but the important thing is that physical death is not the end of a person, so it in itself is not evil. Now on to your quote from Isaiah 45:7 and Amos 3:6. Please note that you are using the King James Version of that passage. Now the KJV is fine, but it was translated 400 years ago and our understanding of ancient languages and the science of textual criticism has increased tremendously since then. Almost all other English translations of the Bible do not use the word evil in these passages. Have a look for yourself: http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?sea... EDIT 2: On natural evil: “You have to explain how one man's action has caused the tectonic plates to move and how the pressure within the earth increased so that molten rock erupts among other things.” I am not sure how to approach this one, not because I am holding a God Trump card, but because it I am not sure exactly what you are asking for here. Are you asking me to explain the exact mechanics of how the curse on Creation leads to each and every natural process whereby people get hurt? If so, I think you are asking too much of a mere mortal! All I or anyone knows is that Creation changed after the curse. How exactly God changed it cannot be known scientifically because all we have to examine empirically is the post-curse Creation, and what is written about the curse: “Cursed is the ground because of you…” etc. But note that just because something is unexplained does not mean that it is unexplainable. I see this all the time in my work as a scientist. An example from my field of work: How is it that gravity (relativistic) is incompatible with the rules of quantum mechanics, yet both theories explain the phenomena they describe to a high degree of accuracy? To demand that one explain how it can be that these theories are contradictory before accepting either in its area of applicability is unwise. The fundamental difference in our thinking may be that I have invested a lot of my time to find out if the Bible can be trusted as the preserved word of God. The results of my investigation lead me to believe that where my knowledge ends, I can trust what the Bible says and hope I can figure it out (or ask God when I see him) later. On judgment: “Tell me, if my grandfather commits a horrible crime, should I be born in a prison?” No, that would not be just. Let me ask you: how do we know it would not be just? We know precisely because we have seen many times that the children of a person who commits a crime do not necessarily commit that same crime. Now let’s talk about Adam. His crime was sinning against God. Have you ever seen or heard of a single living person, over the age of accountability, who has not sinned (with the exception of Jesus of course)? Since the answer must be no, the analogy with your grandfather doesn’t hold on this point. The children of sinners DO sin, period. So it is wrong to say that we are punished for another person’s actions, we are punished because we have a sin nature, that is, we all sin and will keep sinning. It was started by Adam, but that doesn’t change the fact and it doesn’t mean we are punished for what he did. On abortion: The difference here is that when an abortion happens, an innocent person is murdered by another person. But when a natural disaster happens, which may or may not be caused by God, any life taken was his to take! Only God gives life, and since he gives it, he can take it away. Life is a privilege given by God, not a right we have as a sovereign over God. Anyway, thanks for the great questions. You may not agree with me, but I think I have given you decent answers as much as I can, as I am not a Bible scholar, I am just a guy who tries to think things through. There are some things that we may not even be able to see eye-to-eye on simply because we are starting from different places. I also appreciate that the problem of evil is a significant one for anyone believing in an all loving and all powerful God. I admit my thinking on this isn't finished, but I am to a point now where it does make some sense to me. I certainly understand your point of view, as I was raised an atheist and was an atheist until I was about 25 or so. It was going deeper and deeper into my study of physics that convinced me there must be a Deity. How I got from there to Christianity is a longer story I shall not repeat here. Good day.

Reilly Reilly
The author of the Book of Job also wrestled with the problem of theodicy. However, theodicy is not secular because it, by definition, involves a belief in some higher being and/or universal force. When you say you are having a problem, do you mean the problem is reconciling the concept of how evil can exist if God is meant to be all good and all loving, or is your problem simply trying to work out how to define what "evil" means.
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Mignon Mignon
Good and evil are concepts that the mind creates. Outside of the mind in the objective world everything is as it is and it is perfect in being what it is. No matter what evil a person does, they are committing it because it will do some good to themselves or those they love.
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Lexine Lexine
Since I don't believe in Evil, I feel like you are asking me if the tooth fairy is secular or casual. I think of a tutu as formal wear.
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Julia Julia
I encourage you to watch national geographic's The science of evil http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/se... In it they explore the scientific meaning of it using brain scan technology while exploring the philosophical and religious definitions. It's very, very interesting.
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Julia Originally Answered: How would you solve the problem of evil?
The God of the Old Testament is Satan if you do the research... The "Father" of the Father, Sun, and Holy Ghost is the Devil lol... Jesus even tells you this in John chapter 8 so the bible even confirms it. Then if you look at the mythology it's all based upon you can confirm it in numerous other ways. Star Wars is based upon the same story, you have Luke Skywalker the good Sun and his evil father Darth Vader hahaha May the farce be with you

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